User talk:EmperorZelos

Linguistics Tutorial on Conlang
I was wondering if we (by this I mean I, unless you want to do it) could make a tutorial to linguistics. This would be a general overview of everything one would need to know about linguistics because, let's face it, linguistics are scary-looking and have a lot of vocabulary. Most people out there probably don't even understand the concepts of subjects, objects, propositions, etc. If we made this, we would become a more self-sufficient wiki; it's a shame we have to outsource so much about IPA, grammar, alignment, etc., especially if these could be on our own site (for the most part). Plus, it would help to have everything in one place.

I hope you'll consider this option. Thanks. A RMACHEDES 01:17, April 27, 2011 (UTC)

^+1 Razlem 04:27, April 27, 2011 (UTC)

If you look under the "Main Stuff" tab you'll find "Conlang Guide" where you can work for that The Emperor Zelos 05:03, April 27, 2011 (UTC)

I'm thinking it's a little less than satisfactory to have our guide just be a link to the similarly named conling wiki, especially since that page doesn't really contain any useful information. I'm a linguistics undergrad, and I'm sure there's others here with similar experience/expertise/insight in ling. We could make a much better guide. I'm taking the liberty of starting it up: Conlang Guide. Truedat 23:00, July 19, 2011 (UTC)

Please use the link already provided and enhance there, this is a conlang storage rather than linguistic database, the other is lingusitic database and learning The Emperor Zelos 06:43, July 20, 2011 (UTC)

C
Thanks for the advice, but I'm working with 25 different consonants, so I need all the symbols I can get. :) I could probably go with ś instead, but then that's just one more atypical accented character to worry about. (Romanization's never easy, is it?) KedaseDerragar 13:16, April 28, 2011 (UTC)

Nope it isnt but the issue with using C is that you get people missreading it because they tend to read it like they do in english The Emperor Zelos 16:25, April 28, 2011 (UTC)

English speakers seem to figure out how to use the Cs in Italian, Sindarin, and Mandarin Chinese Romanization just fine, so I'm not too worried about it. I don't use this Romanization for ease of reading by Anglophones; I use it because it minimizes the number of special characters I need to type while mass-inputting information while still more or less accurately representing most of the language's sounds. KedaseDerragar 19:55, April 28, 2011 (UTC)

Example unbinaryied
'''Sa'næz'nim, dekni da'nar, kæsha se'næmi, denktai irænoseni hanake, sirnokeni, serena-otas, denktai ihe uenam, æka denktai derahe uenam; kareno okæt ktei. Da'mar marad kæ'æd, kare sæha kozhæn.''' Æka distei iræke'kti, s'neami irænokena, iraina æra metu'kozhænai.

1

Aræke'tur' i'zahetai; okare æd okare; Ækake ætashama koros soha!

Koros marat za'akesi dara'hased a'ar, '''Koros marad dokeriso derahas Uenam morezoren dira'ezahetan Sar'nokam da'mareha-okat adenis, Keinakare sæha; æd keam o kætata. Koros de ra'ezaheram tistae kozhænem, riakozea ah, dektai zahade rerim kurænem.'''

Ækake shæ'ahasen; k'noizahe korasazum Akasha z'mnekædorai mai k'nohasenim.

-Uenem Akasha Ktai

Don't know if I should include it into the example-text info Rostov-na-don ist deine herr Oberst ! 16:01, May 2, 2011 (UTC)

wth?
I don't know why you just deleted my page, but please do not do it again. Truedat 22:19, May 20, 2011 (UTC)

It looked like spasm/unserious stuff as it didnt conform to our template but now that it does I wont The Emperor Zelos 06:16, May 21, 2011 (UTC)

Editor will not save created tables
This has happened every time I try to save a table, but it will only happen if the table has things typed in it. If I save the table and go back and try to re-save it with something in it, it doesn't save the table, or anything else in the section.

works fine for me, dont forgetto sign The Emperor Zelos 01:34, June 5, 2011 (UTC)

I'll see if I can update my browser, flash might need updating, too, thanks for your help Jimbo4567 21:30, June 5, 2011 (UTC)

Tesipa
How do you think it's coming, and do you have an recommendations? I'm mostly done, except I still need to add subclause grammar. —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 14:53, June 24, 2011 (UTC)

I think the exclusion of other voices is rather odd as languages do tend to have other voices to promote the less important in a sentence structure to the more important position "I ate the cat" vs "The cat was eaten by me"

You need an affix hierarchy, is mood or tense/aspect the one going on first or last?

The n- prefix indicating opposite action is nota negation marker because ANY negation marker will instantly be a negation, if a verb means an action does occure or have occured or whatnot its negation must intransicly per definition be the negation of it, namely the action does not occure, the n- prefix becomes merely a morphological way to derive forth a new kind of verb, verb vs nverb becomes 2 different verbs not related through negation.

Where is the phonotactics?

Nom-Acc has a case hierarchy where Genetive must be present prior to the occurance of dative.

If nouns uses case in any extent the pronouns MUST have the case because pronouns are most used and therefor will acquire it first of all and lose it last, like neglish I vs Me

The pro-adverbs are unusualble for you because you arent using adverbs, you need to circumvent it somehow

Best regards The Emperor Zelos 16:59, June 24, 2011 (UTC)

1. Yeah, but I don't have a way to know the case except by sentence structure, so to make it less confusing I am only allowing active.

2. Well, tense/aspect is prefixes and mood is suffixes, so is it necessary? Or not really? The negative and neutral prefixes (n- and t-) go before every prefix, I think I wrote that though.

3. Ok. Now that I think about that the opposite of the verb makes no sense. ^_^

4. Under the phonotactics section. :P It a couple sections below the phonology, above stress and spelling.

5. I don't understand what you mean. I don't have declension for case, it's determined by word order and prepositions (and the particle uf).

6. No cases. Only word order.

7. I am using adverbs, though.

Thanks. —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 18:26, June 24, 2011 (UTC)


 * 1) Confusion is rarely a problem in a language, you could do like english you know
 * 2) THen I misread, if you got multiple you need to make a hierarchy of which is most important
 * 3) good
 * 4) My bad
 * 5) if you got a proper dative case you must have some sort of proper genetive case, aka if you have some kind of declension/particle for dative case genetive must have the same
 * 6) I read it said about Dative, Nom and Acc and genetive
 * 7) I thought you said it didnt have adverbs "Unlike english it doesnt have adverbs"

1. I could, but I don't want to. ^_^ This is the first language I'm intent on finishing, I'm trying to make it very simple so it won't take several decades to learn like Umbrean. xD

2. Ok, that goes under syntax right?

5. No proper cases, just word order. Although genitive has a particle, which is used in syntax like it is in Umbrean.

6. It does have dative, nom, and acc, but they are formed by word order, not declension.

7. No, it said that somewhere else. In the verb section, it said "instead of having the adverb "not", it has the prefix n-," sort of like French.

Anything else? I have another question also, what is the simplest way to make correlatives? Could you only use one time of quantifier and then use prepositions to make it universal, negative, elective, etc? —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 21:02, June 24, 2011 (UTC) 1: Languages are rarely simple unless they are pidgins or creols =) and very funny :P Ive simpålified it recently 2: it would go under syntax yes 5&6: then it doesnt have any of those it just uses word order. it got "Direct" Morphpsyntax 7: my bad The Emperor Zelos 01:34, June 26, 2011 (UTC)

You deleted my page! It's not a real life language! How can I retrieve it? Mamûnám ontā́ bán 12:21, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

Retrieve deleted page!
You deleted my page!! It's not a real life language! How can I retrieve it? Mamûnám ontā́ bán 12:23, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

I managed to get my data back by pressing "back" a few times on my browser, please don't delete my page again, unless you feel you have a good reason, in which case please leave me a message on my talk page first. Mamûnám ontā́ bán 12:41, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

MSN
I seriously fucked up. Sorry :P Rostov-na-don ist deine herr Oberst ! 17:10, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

what now? The Emperor Zelos 17:14, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

As if I know... Skype? Well, I'll also be off until the 17th as I'm going on a vacation :D {insert SEEYASUCKERS here} Rostov-na-don ist dein herr Oberst! 18:13, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

agan? whats your skype? The Emperor Zelos 04:49, July 30, 2011 (UTC)

Blocking IPs
Why? The ones that are coming and working on a language are doing no harm to the wiki, and it is most certainly NOT against community guidelines to allow them to edit. Wikis are supposed to be places that anyone (except vandals) can edit, not that registered users can only edit. —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 22:57, October 2, 2011 (UTC)

It was established long time ago that a constant usage of IPs are not appriciated and that is so you get an identity.

as it is now no one can claim its their conlang for example because an IP can easily change or anything.

The Emperor Zelos 05:00, October 3, 2011 (UTC)

It is against Wikia guidelines to block IPs from editing. I would prefer to turn this into an edit war, because no IP deserved to be blocked for no reason. If some IP decides to come and work on a ocnlang that hasn't been worked on in a year, it's ok. It can be reverted anyway. —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 11:01, October 3, 2011 (UTC)

Okay. . . I had responded to you earlier, but I guess it didn't go through. :/ Anyway, if that happens, and the original contributor wants it reverted, so be it. Just a few clicks of a button. I'm mainly concerned about blocking them for creating an entirely new language, though, not hijacking someone else's. —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 11:03, October 4, 2011 (UTC)

Sounds good, but don't block them for creating new conlangs. —TimeMaster (talk • contribs) 20:19, October 4, 2011 (UTC)

Visual Editing
The visual edit mode won't work because I submitted the page, and now it says that rich text editing won't work because of complex code. I'm new to this, so the visual mode would be appreciated. What should I do?

Djadechu

I suggest you remove some tables and such then, if you got to complicated stuff on the page the visual one will be automaticly disabled

Help?
Hello EmperorZelos, you seem to know a lot about languages and I was wondering if you could help me with some of the tables on the page for my language. I know a lot that is already going to happen but have no idea what each thing specifically means, especially with the phonology sounds. If you can, thanks!

I can help, do you have any IM? The Emperor Zelos 15:31, November 25, 2011 (UTC)


 * I have Skype, email, or phone(text), just email me at MJCLetourneau@gmail.com and I can give you info there.

Some Swedish thing you might know of...
If I remember correctly, you were Swedish, so I was wondering if you know how or where the neuter possessives in Swedish come from(i. e. "mitt", "ditt", "sitt"). I find these forms in the North Germanic languages but not in West Germanic and want to incorporate them into my language which has a common-neuter gender system now. I read that it comes from basically he exact same word in Old Norse, but I find no equivalents in Old English or reconstructed Proto-Germanic root. Sorry for the wall of text good sir. OlykoekSlayer 06:49, November 26, 2011 (UTC)

I honestly dont know where it comes from but considering their closely related structure it is doubtful it has only been pphonological changes but probably so that its a case of words comming into existence/changing for analogical reasons, as a common word (maybe "mitt") came from phonological reasons and due to its commonness it structure the structure was over applied to the other forms aswell to make htem all analogogous.

Though I am not certain on it and its nothing but a guess.

The Emperor Zelos 08:45, November 26, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the info; I get what you mean. Just for some speculation, I was also thinking (maybe) that the first "itt" word came from the same root as English "it". Because Dutch uses the congnate of "it" as a definite article "het", maybe the North Germanic languages applied it as a suffix to genitive determiners. Just a thought, haha OlykoekSlayer 19:43, November 26, 2011 (UTC)

I dont think its from english as its going back to old norse and more so I doubt its origin is english The Emperor Zelos 19:44, November 26, 2011 (UTC)

I didn't mean from English, but from the same root that English has for "it". Because if we can use it as a pronoun and the Dutch can use their cognate as an article, it wouldn't be suprising if the Norse could use theirs as a suffix. But then I suppose we'll never know anyway OlykoekSlayer 20:55, November 26, 2011 (UTC)

Uklantirian
I'll fix it if I get around to it. If I don't have the time, I won't. But if I feel like it, I will. I've already saved the stuff I had on that page on my computer, so even if it's deleted I can still have the words I wrote to rework it when the time comes. I just put it in the format I put it in because I didn't know another format existed. Danke, Straxington 22:23, February 20, 2012 (UTC)

Featured language
I think that we should have a vote within the next week or so for a fresh featured conlang. The current one has been featured since sometime in 2009 I am told. pá mamûnám ontā́ bán 12:22, March 17, 2012 (UTC)

Shoot for it The Emperor Zelos 12:14, March 18, 2012 (UTC)

Maybe you, as an administrator, should consider to allow Darheinen's vote on a featured language? It is getting close to the end now? kyām dēkәr 09:34, April 22, 2012 (UTC)

He's been an active member long enough now, so it should count. pá mamūnám ontā́ bán 10:13, April 22, 2012 (UTC)

Who? Why that all of a sudden? The Emperor Zelos 14:50, April 22, 2012 (UTC)

Dairhenien - he's been registered since 27th March, so for more than 3 weeks and is now eligible to vote. pá mamūnám ontā́ bán

He is The Emperor Zelos 15:18, April 22, 2012 (UTC)

Main page
Halloj! I'll continue on this topic, if you don't mind. Could I have the administrators opinion on my preliminary Main page? Cheers, kyām dēkәr 14:55, April 12, 2012 (UTC)

It is a good start I must say, but the stuff below the heading doesn't look as nice though. The Emperor Zelos 16:07, April 12, 2012 (UTC)

Do you mean the "Creating a language"-heading? kyām dēkәr 16:54, April 12, 2012 (UTC)

That and everything below, I dont think it looks that good as a hole with a long list just extending down. Try doing as the main page is now with blocks around. But the parts and stuff inside eahc section does look good though. The Emperor Zelos 18:47, April 12, 2012 (UTC)

Yes, yes, of course. It's just the pieces of the puzzle, not the full picture! I'll make a proposition for a full layout of the Main page then. I might also take a look at the Conling Wiki, and see if we could connect it with "Creating a Language" somehow. Any specific requests, improvements for my design? kyām dēkәr 20:38, April 12, 2012 (UTC)

So far I think you are on the right track. I will impliment it once its fully done =) The Emperor Zelos 21:09, April 12, 2012 (UTC)

Hi again! I'd be very glad if could have your permission to edit the main page, to fix the layout (when I'm more done)! I need to see how I can use the extra space on the main page. kyām dēkәr 20:55, April 15, 2012 (UTC)

Uh, what do you mean? The Emperor Zelos 14:07, April 16, 2012 (UTC)

I'm asking if I could have your permission to move my code for the main page to the current one, to fix the layout there instead? kyām dēkәr 17:05, April 17, 2012 (UTC)

It is unprotected, you can go ahead and give it a try The Emperor Zelos 20:47, April 18, 2012 (UTC)

Many thanks! There probably won't be a stream of visitors anyways. kyām dēkәr 21:13, April 18, 2012 (UTC)

I have now introduced the first draught of the main page. kyām dēkәr 13:26, April 19, 2012 (UTC)

I approve, just need to fix all the templates and admin pick/featured conlang The Emperor Zelos 16:20, April 19, 2012 (UTC)

The old main page is found here. kyām dēkәr 16:26, April 19, 2012 (UTC)

I know, I can otherwise just rollback if it requires to be pulled back but I doubt it.

FYI
Two stupid pages: Schonbek and Lottery numbers. pá mamûnám ontā́ bán 11:24, March 19, 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome, and some questions.
Once again, thanks for the welcome. I'm looking forward to joining the community.

Speaking of which, where is the community located? Are there message boards, or is most communication done through talk pages?

Also, do you know of a good tutorial for creating and formatting tables? So far, I've been creating them Excel and then copying them over. I can maintain merged cells that way, but none of the formatting comes through. And frankly, I'm lost trying to code it myself. Any advice would be very helpful.

Other than building my own language, what are some other fun things to do here to interact with other members?

Thanks!

Dairhenien 13:51, March 28, 2012 (UTC)

Deletion
Hello! I was just wondering there is any possibility for a "deletion plan" for long since inactive pages and those and the "DELETE ME"-list?

Cheers! kyām dēkәr 08:59, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

I delete those I stumble upon, but what did you have in mind exacly? The Emperor Zelos 08:59, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

Amongst other things, the "Candidates for speedy deletion"-category, as well as sift a bit amongst the langs that seem to be without content (since a long time). I mean, it is not exactly a pressing concern, but it might aid a structuring of the wiki? kyām dēkәr 09:08, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

Feel free to at any point post links to conlangs that is below quality and inactive and I shall delete them. The Emperor Zelos 09:15, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

I could just put the "speedy deletion"-template on the page. Maybe we ought to make some sort of level of completeness and date of last activity? As well as a message? You can never be too certain? kyām dēkәr 09:20, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

what do you mean? The Emperor Zelos 12:02, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

What I am trying to say is that we can't just delete some pages, just because they're inactive. We should leave a message on the article that it is a "canidate for deletion". The message ought to appear on pages that hasn't been edited in a long while, and lacks content. Like this one. (In addition, the creator's not subscribed). kyām dēkәr 12:39, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

I see no point putting anything there, its an IP and all and no one has edited it since so anyone who wants it back can always just come back and tell me and i'll restore it The Emperor Zelos 13:32, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

(Do you mean IP address? - I'm probably a bit stupid) Very well, it is up to you. Just say the word and I and some others could keep our eyes out for dead pages. kyām dēkәr 13:55, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

I did mean it yes, Just tell me whenever you find dead pages and or ones that we cannot improve style wise and I will take care of the rest The Emperor Zelos 15:39, April 9, 2012 (UTC)

Hello again! I've begun adding some languages to this category (just their own requests). I was thinking maybe we should make an official list of the deletion criteria, otherwise I'd feel stupid. For example: the Akad language has not had an edit for 2 years, some for one year (without a registred user) and some lack content or just have vocabulary. kyām dēkәr 10:15, April 13, 2012 (UTC) Those are the ones I can remember on hand The Emperor Zelos 15:36, April 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Inactive
 * 2) Incomplete, you cannot make much out of it, typicly lack any IPA.
 * 3) IP adress made

Okay, basically according to my intuition then? Will you delete the myriad in the "Speedy deletions"-category? I think you've got a couple of pages there too. kyām dēkәr 16:59, April 13, 2012 (UTC)

Basicly and I will work through it The Emperor Zelos 17:02, April 13, 2012 (UTC)